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I Am So Torn


stevedallas

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stevedallas:

We are all very imperfect representatives of Christ. I've tried to honestly give you the answers to the questions that you have asked. I am sorry that I have failed in that attempt.

The Church is a emergency ward for the spirtually injured, not a rest home for the spiritually perfect.

Edited by thesometimesaint
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Not sure what you are saying, but what it appears is that Mormons who join a discussion board are not required to follow LDS teachings like the teachings of L Tom Perry at the last GC. I believe Mormons should follow those teachings no matter where they are. And for someone who has questions regarding certain aspects of the LDS Faith, a board like this is awesome because those issues are discussed. Most regular members would not know how to answer my questions.

Never mind

Edited by ERayR
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stevedallas:

We are all very imperfect representatives of Christ. I've tried to honestly give you the answers to the questions that you have asked. I am sorry that I have failed in that attempt.

The Church is a emergency ward for the spirtually injured, not a rest home for the spiritually perfect.

You have been awesome. My comments were not directed at you. Please, continue to teach me, I am a willing student

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I feel like the biggest fool. Here I am, 51 years old. I am a managing attorney. I was an officer in the Army. I am used to making decisions and sticking with them. I do not waffle. Yet, here I am. I am pulled so much to the LDS Church, but so many issues keep me away. I love the present LDS Church, but have many issues with the past. I love what appears to be current doctrines (or most of them), but have problems with older doctrines (or what they appear to be).

All I want to do is be where God wants me. Some days it almost seems like it is tearing me apart.

Not sure why I posted this. I expect folks will mock me, but there it is

Can i suggest something?

Trust God. Take some action in faith and the Lord will reveal His will to you. Start exercising your faith more and He will make it all clear. But you need to do it.

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I have a very good LDS friend who says the same thing. I often wonder if the pull I feel is God, or just the good feelings I have. Is it God, or my desire? If it is God, then why can;t I get a testimony of the two critical issues? (Book of Mormon and Joseph Smith). If I was not bald, this would make me want to pull my hair out

How has your study of the Book of Mormon and the D&C? It seems if you want a testimony of the Book of Mormon you have to study it. If you want to get a testimony of Joseph Smith you need to study what he taught. Do you read it daily? have you been praying to the Lord Constantly to reveal to you the Truth? When I was seeking it, i didnt even know if there was a God. I just decided to have faith that if there was a way for Him to make Himself known to me, He would. I made the promise to Him that If He did, I would serve Him the best I can and follow Him no matter where He lead me. It was finally reading the D&C particularly section 135 that the Spirit got through to me and witnessed to me of Joseph Smith's calling and the Book of Mormon.

We arent all the same, but the principles God has for us are the same. We need to ask in faith. Fair requires us to act, to believe in Him even if we aren't completely positive about anything.

What do you think of what the Gospel teaches?

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wow. I have never had anyone tell me that I am not living His teachings before. Not sure how to take that.

No one does live all the teachings. I once did an exercise to evaluate myself. I sat down and listed all the things I lived well in the Gospel and all the things I did badly or needed some work on.

I was quite suprised when i had 1.5 principles on the live well side. and everything else on the need some work.

Needless to say, I was even more surprised when that that one principle I thought I had down became more difficult.

as far as I know im doing .5 things well lol. or atleast i was the last time I checked. Of course, Ive been repenting a bit so maybe Im doing alittle better now. I should probably check.

It's a good exercise. it will teach us humility.

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Not sure what you are saying, but what it appears is that Mormons who join a discussion board are not required to follow LDS teachings like the teachings of L Tom Perry at the last GC. I believe Mormons should follow those teachings no matter where they are. And for someone who has questions regarding certain aspects of the LDS Faith, a board like this is awesome because those issues are discussed. Most regular members would not know how to answer my questions.

I think you need God answering your questions. Not members. Sure members can help and act as they are inspired. but it sounds like you need more personal experience with the Lord.

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Honestly, there are so many different version of "what the church believed" before correlation that I'm okay with personally accepting the ones that sit right with me. The point isn't to sign on and follow everything in the program, but to use our own spiritual judgement to discriminate.

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  • 2 years later...

been there done that, and still doing that! for me the anchor is our savior and He will answer all questions so be patient. what works for me is to have  one thing something in this church you know is only found here, one thing for me is the blessing to know Joseph smith is a prophet of God.another is the Book of mormon and its truthfulness. and so it goes the questions the doubts etc you come to see some stuff that makes you just wanna scream. i always go to God is perfect and there is a reason for everything. yes people in the church make mistakes look in the old and new testament, theres people making mistakes all over the place, why you think there was a fire sale on making mistakes. also on line people out right lie twist mangle distort and all kinds of deception, so you gotta be careful. itll all test you and thats good cause itll make you a lean mean disciple 0f Christ machine, meaning no disrespect. like our leaders say question your questions, the Holy ghost will show you the truth of all things we just gotta work it out thru faith and then comes the knowledge. i hope you find you path and the blessings that are yours, and have fun.

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I feel like the biggest fool. Here I am, 51 years old. I am a managing attorney. I was an officer in the Army. I am used to making decisions and sticking with them. I do not waffle. Yet, here I am. I am pulled so much to the LDS Church, but so many issues keep me away. I love the present LDS Church, but have many issues with the past. I love what appears to be current doctrines (or most of them), but have problems with older doctrines (or what they appear to be).

All I want to do is be where God wants me. Some days it almost seems like it is tearing me apart.

Not sure why I posted this. I expect folks will mock me, but there it is

 

I would suggest that you put Moroni's promise to work for you.  Do some fervent prayer and listen to the answer.  I would ask:  If you like the present day church what difference does the historical issues make.  You are accepting and covenanting with what is now, not what was or perceived to have been.

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I feel like the biggest fool. Here I am, 51 years old. I am a managing attorney. I was an officer in the Army. I am used to making decisions and sticking with them. I do not waffle. Yet, here I am. I am pulled so much to the LDS Church, but so many issues keep me away. I love the present LDS Church, but have many issues with the past. I love what appears to be current doctrines (or most of them), but have problems with older doctrines (or what they appear to be).

All I want to do is be where God wants me. Some days it almost seems like it is tearing me apart.

Not sure why I posted this. I expect folks will mock me, but there it is

Not sure who said it..."I have a testimony of the gospel, I don't have a testimony of Church history". Our leaders of the past and today are men with all the weaknesses of men. They are not perfect, neither were the Apostles of old.m
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DH was also in the military when he just knew he was supposed to be baptized.  He says he didnt' get his testimony of Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon until over a year later when he was in the MTC being trained for his mission.

 

You might consider reading "When Your Prayers Seem Unanswered" by Brad Wilcox    It will help you understand the process of prayer.   And take heart, Brigham Young is said to have taken three years of study before joining.   (He may have missed out on some good things during that time, but your journey just make take some time that is different from another's.   That is quite alright.)

 

(And when you have been in the LDS church for a time and served in callings, you will see that your best personal efforts to follow Him and do what He would have you do, are sometimes known in retrospect to have just been wrong.  Once you have a couple of those experiences, it is easier for you to understand that one grows in doctrinal understanding, and sometimes even people others perceive as great spiritual leaders have to grow line upon line, even when they are in leadership positions.

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I feel like the biggest fool. Here I am, 51 years old. I am a managing attorney. I was an officer in the Army. I am used to making decisions and sticking with them. I do not waffle. Yet, here I am. I am pulled so much to the LDS Church, but so many issues keep me away. I love the present LDS Church, but have many issues with the past. I love what appears to be current doctrines (or most of them), but have problems with older doctrines (or what they appear to be).

All I want to do is be where God wants me. Some days it almost seems like it is tearing me apart.

Not sure why I posted this. I expect folks will mock me, but there it is

I know just lots of Mormons that engage the church to the limit of their comfort and stop. You do not have to buy into the whole thing and why should you. We are all humans and though we believe that the church is guided by the Prophet who is guided by God, I am sure that he would say that he makes mistakes.

 

You could do worse than joining the Mormon Church. And, even if you do not stay with it, you will learn much. Have you started seeing Missionaries yet? That will take some time, and answer your questions. And when you are Bapized, something "Old Testament" could happen to you like it did me.

 

If you are a heterosexual male or female, it will be much easier for you. For those who are not, there is still a path, though it if fraught with difficulties.

 

Give it a try.

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yes

 

He has

 

His profile indicates his last sign-in was November 2011.  It may be that he has signed in anonymously, or perhaps he has created an alternative identity (a "sock puppet).  But it appears that he has been very scarce here. 

 

So, dare I presume that CountyBoy is stevedallas's sock puppet?  You needn't answer that.

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I feel like the biggest fool. Here I am, 51 years old. I am a managing attorney. I was an officer in the Army. I am used to making decisions and sticking with them. I do not waffle. Yet, here I am. I am pulled so much to the LDS Church, but so many issues keep me away. I love the present LDS Church, but have many issues with the past. I love what appears to be current doctrines (or most of them), but have problems with older doctrines (or what they appear to be).

All I want to do is be where God wants me. Some days it almost seems like it is tearing me apart.

Not sure why I posted this. I expect folks will mock me, but there it is

 

The thing about the past of the LDS Church is that it needn't be a problem.  When we consider the Primitive Church, in other words, the post-Resurrection apostolic Church of Jesus Christ, we know a few notorious things (Ananias and Saphira, for example) and a few polticial things (Stephen the Gentile and Paul the renegade Pharisee), but by and large we don't know a lot of controversial things.  It may be the case that there were lots of funny things going on in the Church that if we knew about them we would wonder about it as much as some people wonder about the LDS Church.  There were anti-Christian elements who made all kinds of nasty insinuations about the Christians, and there would have been some Christians who made such accusations seem reasonable.  Considering the accusations made by the Lord through John's Book of Revelation, it is very clear that bad things were happening inside of Christianity.

 

But those odd or bad things did not invalidate the Gospel, did they?  Of course not!

 

We just happen to know more about the history of the LDS church than we do of the Primitive Church. 

 

I wouldn't let it bother you, ultimately.  Do what the Spirit tells you to do!  I did, and have never regretted it one second.

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I do not believe the first vision story. I do not believe the tales that include him running on a bad leg at night through fields carrying the plates and still outrunning people. I have problems with how he was told about the plates in comparison with other tales of the day. I have a problem with the fact that how it was translated changed over the years. I have problems with a young uneducated man in backwoods 1880s America translating something from a language no one has heard of and coming up with language that sounds like very learned British Scholars from 1600s England. I have problems with lifting chapters from the KJV of the Bible. I have problems with all the "and it came to pass". It makes the book sound like someone was inventing a story, but, in an effort to sound Biblical, he peppered the book with that phrase.

Please do not get me wrong, I WANT to believe those things. But praying has not helped.

I listen to LDS singers on occasion. One of my favorites is Hilary Weeks. She has a song called "More Like a Whisper" that I LOVE. It is so true.....but yet, I do not even hear the whisper.

Forgive my ranting. But, it feels good to discuss this.

Do you also disbelieve the miracles recorded in the Bible, or is it just the miracles of Mormonism you have trouble believing? And if you do believe in the miracles of the Bible, what makes them more believable than the miracles of Mormonism?

18 And who shall say that Jesus Christ did not do many mighty miracles? And there were many mighty miracles wrought by the hands of the apostles.

19 And if there were miracles wrought then, why has God ceased to be a God of miracles and yet be an unchangeable Being? And behold, I say unto you he changeth not; if so he would cease to be God; and he ceaseth not to be God, and is a God of miracles.

20 And the reason why he ceaseth to do miracles among the children of men is because that they dwindle in unbelief, and depart from the right way, and know not the God in whom they should trust.

21 Behold, I say unto you that whoso believeth in Christ, doubting nothing, whatsoever he shall ask the Father in the name of Christ it shall be granted him; and this promise is unto all, even unto the ends of the earth. (Mormon 9)

I must say if you have trouble believing that with God's help the very athletic and powerful 22 year old Joseph Smith was able to outrun his enemies while carrying the gold alloy plates, there's little hope you'll ever have enough faith to believe in Mormonism.  The natural man within you has caused you to set the bar of belief too high. You see, the natural man doesn't want to be convinced because he is hardwired not to believe. As long as the natural man within you is allowed to predominate, there will be no room for overcoming faith...

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. (1 Corinthians 2)

 

So there's a hardwired component within your human nature that doesn't want to believe, while simultaneously there also exists a spiritual component of your nature that does want to believe. To break the impasse you must focus upon and nurture the part of your nature that wants to believe, while focusing less on the spiritually unresponsive part that doesn't want to believe...

27 But behold, if ye will awake and arouse your faculties, even to an experiment upon my words, and exercise a particle of faith, yea, even if ye can no more than desire to believe, let this desire work in you, even until ye believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my words. (Alma 27)

Edited by teddyaware
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I feel like the biggest fool. Here I am, 51 years old. I am a managing attorney. I was an officer in the Army. I am used to making decisions and sticking with them. I do not waffle. Yet, here I am. I am pulled so much to the LDS Church, but so many issues keep me away. I love the present LDS Church, but have many issues with the past. I love what appears to be current doctrines (or most of them), but have problems with older doctrines (or what they appear to be).

All I want to do is be where God wants me. Some days it almost seems like it is tearing me apart.

Not sure why I posted this. I expect folks will mock me, but there it is

I don't believe they will actually hurt you. The present church is very nice. The past is in the past, so leave it there and move on. Sure, the church made some mistakes, or "needed further revelation" (:)).   I wish I could say I never made any mistakes.

 

The Missionaries met me, taught me, and got me baptized in defiance of all logic.  In the interim, they stopped a suicide, convinced Heavenly Father to heal me on so many fronts, and when I was baptized, healed me of life long rage and hatred from extreme abuse and molestation. After Baptisim, it was gone and has stayed gone since January of 2012.

 

You don't have anything to worry about. You are male and heterosexual, right? You have nothing to worry about. Who knows you might be a Bishop or in the Stake Presidency in a few years.

 

They have issues with me, though I have done nothing wrong, so I do not have a future like you do. Go forth and conquer!

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