Joseph Smith - Lets Add Some Context.

[Zakuska]

There are two sides to every story.

Lets add some context to the fairy tales Anti-Mormons like to spin about Joseph Smith.

"Told about Wm. [William] Law—wished to be married to his wife for eternity. Mr. [Joseph] Smith would inquire of the Lord, answered no because

Law was a adulterous person

. Mrs. Law wanted to know why she could not be married to Mr. Law. Mr. [Joseph Smith] S. said [he] would not wound her feelings be telling her. Some days after, Mr. [Joseph] Smith going toward his office. Mrs. Law stood in the door, beckoned to him the once did not know whether she beckoned to him, went across to inquire. Yes, please to walk in, no one but herself in the house, she drawing her arms around him,

if you won't seal me to my husband seal myself unto you, he said, stand away and pushing her gently aside giving her a denial and going out.

When Mr. [William] Law came home he inquired who had been in his absence, she said no one but Br. Joseph, he then demanded what had passed.

Mrs. L. [Law] then told Joseph wanted her to married to him—

"

Alexander Neibaur, Diary, LDS Archives, Pg. 15

That adds some context to why William Law Apostatized and printed the Expositor.

Called at Brother J. S. [Joseph Smith's]. Met Mr. Bonnie. Brother Joseph [smith] told us the first call he had a revival meeting. His mother, brother and sisters got religion. He wanted to get religion too; he wanted to feel and shout like the rest but could feel nothing. [He] opened his Bible of the first passage that struck him was [James 1:5.], "If any man lack wisdom, let him ask of God, who giveth to all men liberally and upbraideth not." [He] went into the woods to pray, kneels himself down, his tongue was closed, cleaving to his roof, could utter not a word, but felt easier after awhile. [He] saw a fire toward heaven, came near and nearer.

[He] saw a personage in the fire, light complexion, blue eyes, a piece of white cloth drawn over his shoulders, his right arm bare. After a while another person came to the side of the first. Mr. [Joseph] Smith then asked, "Must I join the Methodist Church?" "No, they are not my people. [They] have gone astray; there is none that doeth good, not one, but this is my Beloved Son, harken ye him."

The fire drew nigher, rested upon the tree, enveloped him. Comforted, I endeavored to arise but felt uncommon feeble.

got into the house and told the Methodist priest [who] said this was not an age for God to reveal himself in vision.

Revelation has ceased with the New Testament.

Alexander Neibaur, Diary, LDS Archives, Pg. 15

Intresting details about the first vision. (2 Personages)

So has the Methodist Minister been Identified to whom Joseph spoke?

http://www.neibaur.o...rnals/alex.html

Edited August 15, 2011 by Zakuska

[LeSellers]

has the Methodist Minister been Identified to whom Joseph spoke?

Definitively? No, but it is a fair guess that we're talking of Rev. George Lane.

Lehi

Edited August 15, 2011 by LeSellers

[Zakuska]

Definitively? No, but it is a fair guess that we're talking of Rev. George Lane.

Lehi

I wonder if in the Joseph Smith Papers if we have anything written by Rev. Lane RE: the first vision etc.?

[Questing Beast]

Of course, given Joseph Smith's already existing polyandry, it is likely that he proposed to Mrs. Law first, then when she rebuffed him, Joseph turned the story around to make him refuse her inappropriate advances. William Law was entirely devoted to Joseph Smith until he learned of polygamy. We have clear evidence of Joseph Smith lying over polygamy (especially polyandry). I do not know of clear evidence that the Laws, Mr. or Mrs., were liars. Any accusations of such only come after the Laws broke with Joseph Smith and his religion....

[Ariarates]

That adds some context to why William Law Apostatized and printed the Expositor.

Was there ever any doubt as to why Law apostatized? I don't think you're going to impress the anti-Mormons with this; you're just giving them an opportunity to point out the instances that Joseph Smith actually did marry other men's wives.

Intresting details about the first vision. (2 Personages)

Wasn't this an 1844 diary entry? The 2 personages were old news by then.

[Zakuska]

Was there ever any doubt as to why Law apostatized? I don't think you're going to impress the anti-Mormons with this; you're just giving them an opportunity to point out the instances that Joseph Smith actually did marry other men's wives.

No doubt at all. The detail of "Joseph in Egypt" though.

Wasn't this an 1844 diary entry? The 2 personages were old news by then.

1841

[Ariarates]

Nope, pretty sure it was 1844. Was Neibaur even in America in 1841?

[Zakuska]

According to his Diary (I linked in the OP) he left England. February 5, 1841 and arrived in New Orleans... March 31. And by June 1 1841 he moved into his Nauvoo house.

But you called it correctly because page 15 starts with " [p.15] May 24, [1844]"

Edited August 15, 2011 by Zakuska

[Ariarates]

According to his Diary (I linked in the OP) he left England. February 5, 1841 and arrived in New Orleans... March 31. And by June 1 1841 he moved into his Nauvoo house.

O, ok, I thought it was later.

[LeSellers]

I wonder if in the Joseph Smith Papers if we have anything written by Rev. Lane RE: the first vision etc.?

I'm far from having an inclusive library, but I have never seen anything from his pen that mentions the vision or the conversation with Joseph.

Lehi

[KevinG]

it is likely that he proposed to Mrs. Law first, then when she rebuffed him, Joseph turned the story around to make him refuse her inappropriate advances.

CFR

"...it is likely..." does not seem like a good source.

The whole point of the OP was that there are two sides to every story with the bonus of providing a contemprary view.

[Questing Beast]

CFR

"...it is likely..." does not seem like a good source.

The whole point of the OP was that there are two sides to every story with the bonus of providing a contemprary view.

Okay, CFR back at you: show that Mr. and Mrs. Law were accused of being liars before their break over polygamy. I said "it is likely", given Joseph Smith's proven dishonesty in covering his polygamous activities. He had approached other men's wives before. When rebuffed he used coercion. When that failed, he made sure that any fallout was the fault of the women. Read it all in Todd Compton's, "In Sacred Loneliness"....

[Xander]

No doubt at all. The detail of "Joseph in Egypt" though.

1841

Still old news. Are you even familiar with the critical argument? Doesn't seem so.

And contrary to your assertion, Neibar's account is mentioned on anti-Mormon websites.