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Kozaru

All About Mormons

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So, who has seen this episode of South Park. What did you think? Was it historically accurate? How does it affect missionary efforts. How does it affect the LDS with doubts?

A complete transcript of the episode can be found HERE.

An interesting page about this episode, by RFM's Deconstructor, can be found HERE.

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I didn't watch the Episode but my friend learned all he knew about mormons from that episode.. from what he relayed to me it wasn't very accurate heh. I don't plan to read the transcript but I pointed him to a better place to learn LDS beliefs (www.lds.org)

Peace,

Adam

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I didn't watch the Episode but my friend learned all he knew about mormons from that episode.. from what he relayed to me it wasn't very accurate

Can you elaborate? Which parts weren't accurate?

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I didn't watch the Episode but my friend learned all he knew about mormons from that episode.. from what he relayed to me it wasn't very accurate

Can you elaborate? Which parts weren't accurate?

For a review of South Park's inaccuracies check out 17 year old Robert Broylan's review here.

Robert introduced himself here a few months ago. Among other things he notes:

In regards to Joseph

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HA! Funny that people would actually look to South Park for insight to the LDS faith (dum da-dum dum dum. I mean, I don't know if there are people thet really would look to it, but if they did they would be 'dum da-dum dum dum'

(BTW, if you HAVE seen it, you will get the dum da-dum dum dum references :P )

Although, in their defense, if you DO want to find gospel accuracies in South Park episodes, may I refer you to the famous scene in which all inhabitants of earth are in hell and among the religious sects pleading for answers as to why they weren't saved, the bottom line was: 'Well if we didn't make it to heaven then who did?' Answer: 'Uh, it was the Mormons, yes the More-mons'...LOL pretty funny stuff though!

MF

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How does it affect missionary efforts

you can't be serious

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I didn't watch the Episode but my friend learned all he knew about mormons from that episode.. from what he relayed to me it wasn't very accurate

Can you elaborate? Which parts weren't accurate?

Well, if you want to be technical, here are some inaccuracies:

Stan: The... Book of Mormon? What's that?

Gary: You know... the book that Joseph Smith found.

Found? He was directed to it by Moroni, and before that time had no idea of it's existence. This was later corrected by the producers, but Joseph Smith did not "find" anything.

Smith: I was out in the woods, praying [a shot of him on his knees in the woods] I was asking God if I should be a Protestant, or a Catholic, or what? And suddenly God and Jesus appeared before me. [a bright light appears before him and he shields his eyes from the glare] And they said I should start my own church, because none of the others had it right. [the flashback ends] And that's exactly how it happened.

He was never told to "start his own church". This is what actually happened, according to Joseph's own record:

19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: "they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof."

  20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, "Never mind, all is well

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What is even more pathetic is that people like Kozaru are here to speak out against LDS, yet can't even see how South Park is wrong with even with the most basic information about the church.

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How does it affect missionary efforts

you can't be serious

Don't knock that question. I heard about that particular South Park episode the next day at work, from coworkers. They did not see it as particularly unfavorable to the Church (considering the source), and it got some of them curious enough to ask me questions about LDS history/beliefs. There's no doubt in my mind that some missionaries encountered folks who watched this South Park episode.

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One would think so, the type of people who watch probably don't get very religious but get exposed to that confusing episode, and will make them curious enough to talk to an LDS friend.

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So, who has seen this episode of South Park.

I've listened to the sound file, but haven't seen it.

What did you think?

I think it was incredibly funny, while at the same time being blasphemous and full of artistic license - standard SP fare. I think we got equal treatment from the Southpark people - I can't really claim that they treated Mormons any different than any other subject of their episodes.

Was it historically accurate?

Oh come on. It was a SouthPark show. Their particular blend of funny includes truth mixed with crap. Things taken out of context. Things portrayed in that unique blend of accuracy and inaccuracy for comedic purposes.

How does it affect missionary efforts.

I actually think this is a decent question. For immature folks (which are probably very well represented in SP viewer demographic), it probably doesn't do much of anything at all. People watching SP looking for truth aren't exactly the whitest part of the harvest.

The Harrison family depiction was hillarious, and could be a challenge for your standard LDS person to talk about and respond to. It's hard to respond to caricature. If you look at what the Harrison's are (family oriented, smart, talented, great individuals, loving and caring and involved in each other's lives), well, yes, that's what we try to be. But the caricature paints them as much more shallow and agenda driven than my experience. In SP, the Harrison's are only a happy family for one reason - it helps them sucker people into Mormonism.

Stan: Why do you have to be so freakin' nice all the time - it isn't normal!  You just weasel people into your way of thinking by acting like the happiest family in the world and being so nice to everyone that you just blindside dumb people like my dad!

Stan's Dad: Yeah! [slams door]

Brother Harrison:  Well kids... [sad pause]  Who's up for a WATER BALOON FIGHT?!!!

Harrison Family: YAY!!!

Is it funny? It's hillarious - caricature at it's finest. Do I recognize parts of my culture in the Harrisons? Yep. Do nonLDS folks that have ever lived around the LDS recognize the Harrisons? You bet. Is it a fully level and honest account of why the Harrisons do what they do? Nah.

How does it affect the LDS with doubts?

Like any other bit of critical information. It's good "anti-mormon" material, for lack of a better term. Truth mixed with crap and things taken out of context, uncharitable artistic license when none is warranted.

Wunna

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I agree it was pretty funny.......I found myself laughing eventhough I had a pit in my stomach at the same time. I watched it with my 4 teenage boys who weren't laughing very much. I think adults know satire and sometimes kids take it personally. They had sick looks on their faces,,,,but we had a good discussion afterwards. I had to do some damage control and put things in perspective. The best I could do was "great and spacious building, laughing, pointing, and mocking,,,,,and how some people let go of the iron rod because of it". Kids don't care what's accurate or not,,,they only care that they are being laughed at. It was very mocking.....but consider the source.

Speaking of the source,,,,,I had heard somewhere that one of the main writers for South Park "used to be Mormon" whatever that means. Probably grew-up quasi-LDS,,,,,I can't remember which guy it was. Trey somebody? That's probably why he felt he had license to make a mockery.

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Do a search on the creator's of South Park. Specifically Trey Parker, Mormon. Or Trey Parker, ex-mormon. They aren't just a couple of guys that decided to all of the sudden pick on the mormon's. It appears their roots go deeper than that. Has anyone seen the South Park movie? These are the same guys that have the mormon's in heaven and all the other religions in hell. Of course in heaven the mormon's are eating green jello. They sound like typical ex-mormon's.

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No it wasn't historically accurate, but it was enough to show me the story of Joseph and his hat and rock. I had never heard that before and upon reading about it for myself, that was enough for me to leave permanently.

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....that was enough for me to leave permanently.

Whoa, chalk another one up for Trey and friends......

Ryan quits the church after watching an episode of South Park. There's a solid foundation. You must not have read much church history before if you hadn't heard of the seer stone and using the hat so he could block out the light better in order to see the words as they appeared. Sounds weird, but probably very effecient,,,,,if of course a seer stone really works. In fact, let's assume Joseph was a complete fraud. Why would he go to that weird trouble of stones and hats? Why not just write the Book of Mormon and skip the antics? Or even with the help of Oliver Cowdry as his scribe,,,,why not just stay behind the curtain and dictate from the plates? To me, this actually adds credibility to the story. The book was either from God or it wasn't. Had we no historical evidence of HOW it got from God to paper,,,,I'd have a problem with it. God works in mysterious ways, but also very literal ways. Assuming it's true,,,,how would you presume a 6th grade educated boy would get the words from point A to point B?

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o.k. first of all you know nothing about me or what my foundation in the church was before i saw that episode. But let's face it, that story is not something that is broadcast publicly by the church. In the last 12 sets of missionaries that have come into my home since watching that episode, NOT ONE has known about Joseph and his hat. Why do you think they don't teach them about it at the MTC? If I had to guess, it would be because it is a ridiculous story that would not go over well with prospective converts today. And another thing, if that IS the way the book came about, according to the story, words would not disappear from the hat unless they were written down correctly. So then why the changes in the BOM over the years? What, god doesn't know how to spell? He's not bright enough to realize the difference between king benjamen and king solomon? He realized later on he didn't clarify himself well enough on the whole trinity thing?

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In fact, let's assume Joseph was a complete fraud. Why would he go to that weird trouble of stones and hats? Why not just write the Book of Mormon and skip the antics? Or even with the help of Oliver Cowdry as his scribe,,,,why not just stay behind the curtain and dictate from the plates? To me, this actually adds credibility to the story.

If we assume Joseph was a fraud and a con-artist, then the whole act makes perfect sense. The art of the con is to put on a good presentation. Con-artists are performers.

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o.k. first of all you know nothing about me or what my foundation in the church was before i saw that episode.

True......sorry.

If I had to guess, it would be because it is a ridiculous story that would not go over well with prospective converts today.

I would say "weird",,,,,not necessarily "ridiculous",,,,,,

Probably in the same "weird" category as other things we wouldn't tell prospective converts in the spirit of "milk before meat",,,,,like funny-looking underwear from the temple, etc.

Other "weird" or maybe even "ridiculous" stories:

Painting your front door with blood so an angel wouldn't kill your first-born son.

Not turning around and looking so you won't turn into a pillar of salt.

Eating bread and drinking water which symbolizes flesh and blood, respectively.

Telling you to kill your only son, and then stopping you when you almost do it.

Telling people God took his finger and wrote 10 things on a stone,,,,,,yea right. I bet Moses just took a chisel up Mt. Sinai that day.

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you are absolutely right, which is why I don't believe in the bible either.

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Well hey, as long as you reject all of Christianity, and not be like those hypocrits who reject the Book of Mormon only to be caught up in the silly Christian sub-culture "I've been saved" attitude.

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nope. that's gay.

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I thought the episode was hilarious, and I couldn't believe how accurate they were.

If we compare the South Park episode to the recent First Vision DVD, I wonder how each would stand as "accurate"? Giving South Park an allowance for it's satiracal and humorous bent, and the Church DVD for being a sales tool to present its history in a pleasing, processed form most likely to not freak out people with pictures of Joseph with his face buried in a hat.

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ryanw:

No it wasn't historically accurate, but it was enough to show me the story of Joseph and his hat and rock. I had never heard that before and upon reading about it for myself, that was enough for me to leave permanently.
...
But let's face it, that story is not something that is broadcast publicly by the church. In the last 12 sets of missionaries that have come into my home since watching that episode, NOT ONE has known about Joseph and his hat. Why do you think they don't teach them about it at the MTC? If I had to guess, it would be because it is a ridiculous story that would not go over well with prospective converts today

I'm a little confused. In what way is a seer stone in a hat more ridiculous than, say, a pair of "magic spectacles"? If I remember correctly, "magic spectacles" was the cause of much hilarity among early critics of the church. I'm not sure I understand the perceived motivation here. Why would the church go out of its way to cover up one ridiculous scenario, only to replace it with an equally ridiculous scenario?

you are absolutely right, which is why I don't believe in the bible either.

Now I'm really confused. Did Joseph's "rock-in-a-hat" story cause you to disbelieve the Bible, too? Or did that come from a different South Park episode?

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no, i decided that if that story was unbelievalbe, then the others were too. after all, they aren't really any different and I can see why some people would still believe in the church, without letting that get to them. i do disagree however, with the story being "swept under the rug". now in saying that, all of you will say "it isn't swept under the rug, I know about it" but you are all a different breed. as i mentioned earlier, the last 24 missionaries i've spoken with do not know about the story, every single one of my and my wife's friends do not know about it, and our families do not know about it. i think it should be made public and is something that is shown in the videos or discussions.

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Missionaries are kids, we don't send learned men to prove it. We send humble young boys who must depend on the spirit. And people convert because they feel the Holy Ghost as their proof.

The gosple is very simple, for you to know God lives and that the church is true is by the Holy Spirit. Evidence form the source.

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