Wikipedia: Mormonism and Polygamy

[zelder]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_polygamy

This article makes early mormons and the origins of polygamy in mormonism look pretty bad. Before reading this I had never heard of a "Cochranite". The article completely ignores the existence of plural marriage in the Old Testement. Seems like a very slanted article. You can't help but think Joseph Smith and the early apostles were a bunch of dirty lying perverts when reading this (that is if this is all you know abou them).

Any thoughts?

[Vex]

I tend to shy away from articles that state the neutrality of this subject is disputed. Which to me is a big warning sign telling me that all the information is either not presented or information is spun in such a way as to achieve an agenda.

[zelder]

I tend to shy away from articles that state the neutrality of this subject is disputed. Which to me is a big warning sign telling me that all the information is either not presented or information is spun in such a way as to achieve an agenda.

That's a good point but I don't see the neutrality of this subject being disputed.

[cinepro]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_polygamy

This article makes early mormons and the origins of polygamy in mormonism look pretty bad. Before reading this I had never heard of a "Cochranite". The article completely ignores the existence of plural marriage in the Old Testement. Seems like a very slanted article. You can't help but think Joseph Smith and the early apostles were a bunch of dirty lying perverts when reading this (that is if this is all you know abou them).

Any thoughts?

Can you cite some of the specific claims in that article that you find disturbing?

I'm not too familiar with the "Cochranites", but here's a little more info from the Wikipedia article on Jacob Cochran:

Cochran also was working towards a communal order where everything was held in common. However, within a few years, Cochran was eventually convicted of gross lewdness, lascivious behavior, and adultery and spent four years in prison. His followers were once said to be in the thousands, but only a handful remained loyal to their prophet after his imprisonment.

A few years after his release from prison, Jacob Cochran established a colony for a portion of his followers, in what is now Grove township, Allegany Co., New York. This little-known group lived in close proximity to several people who later became prominent members within the Latter Day Saint Movement including Warren Cowdery, William Marks and Lyman Wight -- the first Mormon branches in Allegany County were established in the area immediately surrounding the Cochranite colony, during the early 1830s.

Cochran has been called a "John the Baptist" for Mormonism by Saco Valley historian G.T. Ridlon because so many Cochranites were among those who converted to Mormonism and moved west. Although the Cochranites practiced a type of "spiritual wifery" (see above) which sanctioned multiple female partners for each man in the group, their doctrines did not include the precept of "eternal marriage", and thus differed slightly from Utah Mormon polygamy.

Latter Day Saint historical sources indicate that Mormon missionaries were laboring successfully to make converts among Maine's Cochranites as early as 1832: at the Church conference held in Saco, Maine on August 21, 1835, at least seven of the newly ordained apostles were in attendance. John C. Bennett, a leading Mormon who was excommunicated, is credited with introducing the Cochranite term spiritual wifery to Mormonism. Bennett's version of the multiple female partners practice appears to have more closely resembled Jacob Cochran's doctrine than it did the precept of polygamy alleged to exist among the Latter Day Saints.

[zelder]

Under the title"The Origin of Plural Marriage" they talk about Cochran and make is seem as though the mormons got the idea from Cochran and just followed his example. They also talk about Bennett is such a way that Smith looks like a horrible hypocrite and liar.

[cinepro]

Under the title"The Origin of Plural Marriage" they talk about Cochran and make is seem as though the mormons got the idea from Cochran and just followed his example. They also talk about Bennett is such a way that Smith looks like a horrible hypocrite and liar.

It's Wikipedia. If you have better references and think you can make the article more accurate, go in and edit it to make it better.

[TAO]

Yes, I wouldn't trust Wikipedia's unbiased-ness to much on issues realted to Mormonism. I check out the article on DCP and they used the word 'ludicrous' to describe the claims of the church, and so I had to fix that... because that IS bias.

[Vex]

That's a good point but I don't see the neutrality of this subject being disputed.

Scroll down and you'll see a warning regarding a section of it. Just because there is no warning displayed on the wiki article does not mean there isn't neutrality issues being discussed in the forum itself.

[cinepro]

This blog post also discusses the Cochranites and their possible relationship to Mormon polygamy.

You have probably never heard of the Cochranites, because this odd religious community simply vanished from history sometime in the late 1830's. While they were on the scene, though, they stirred up quite a fuss and enjoyed no small amount of notoriety. Richard and Pamela Price, the husband and wife authors of Joseph Smith Fought Polygamy reproduce several articles from books and newspapers of the era that tell of the charismatic leader Jacob Cochran, who convinced some two thousand supporters that what he called

[thesometimesaint]

The Bible predates the Cochranites and is one of the substantiations for the LDS.

[ELF1024]

http://en.wikipedia....sm_and_polygamy

This article makes early mormons and the origins of polygamy in mormonism look pretty bad. Before reading this I had never heard of a "Cochranite". The article completely ignores the existence of plural marriage in the Old Testement. Seems like a very slanted article. You can't help but think Joseph Smith and the early apostles were a bunch of dirty lying perverts when reading this (that is if this is all you know abou them).

Any thoughts?

Anything on Wikipedia that deals with Religion or Politics should be distrusted from the beginning.

[california boy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_polygamy

This article makes early mormons and the origins of polygamy in mormonism look pretty bad. Before reading this I had never heard of a "Cochranite". The article completely ignores the existence of plural marriage in the Old Testement. Seems like a very slanted article. You can't help but think Joseph Smith and the early apostles were a bunch of dirty lying perverts when reading this (that is if this is all you know abou them).

Any thoughts?

Just wondering what in the article you think was bad. I thought Wikipedia was pretty accurate. Could you be more specific what you thought was not accurate? You would have to be Biblical illiterate to not know that early patriarchs didn't practice polygamy.

Sometimes I think modern Mormons seem to be embarrassed about this part of the churches history and become very defensive about it. While I am glad that the church no longer practices plural marriage, I fully understand the rational that supported this doctrine. One just has to read Parley P. Pratts speech to congress on this subject to get the churches defense of this doctrine. There is nothing to be defensive about. It was a doctrine instituted by God. Mormons practiced it. If people have issues with it, take it up with God.

[Kevin Christensen]

For a helpful look at Mormonism and the Wikipedia, see the FAIR Wiki Entry on dealing with Wikipedia.

http://en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_Wikipedia

Kevin Christensen

Pittsburgh, PA

[california boy]

I still can't see what specifically anyone has a problem with in the wiki article. If no one can point to anything specifically, then how bad can the article be? Doesn't anyone have anything to say about the posting that they disagree with???

[NauvooSaint]

I think it's great they cover a lot of ground from different angles. Of course people with different viewpoints will not fully agree with everything presented. I certainly don't, however it should be understood that Wikipedia is resource outside of the LDS church that isn't sugarcoated.

[Jason]

Anything on Wikipedia that deals with Religion or Politics should be distrusted from the beginning.

Quoted for truth. It's pretty much a given that any religious or political article on Wikipedia will be written by people with biases and likely an agenda as well.

[Jason]

I still can't see what specifically anyone has a problem with in the wiki article. If no one can point to anything specifically, then how bad can the article be? Doesn't anyone have anything to say about the posting that they disagree with???

The article basically says that the Church borrowed the idea from the Cochranites.

[phaedrus ut]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_polygamy

This article makes early mormons and the origins of polygamy in mormonism look pretty bad. Before reading this I had never heard of a "Cochranite". The article completely ignores the existence of plural marriage in the Old Testement. Seems like a very slanted article. You can't help but think Joseph Smith and the early apostles were a bunch of dirty lying perverts when reading this (that is if this is all you know abou them).

Any thoughts?

It definitely wasn't written as apologetic or faith promoting but from what I read it's accurate.

Phaedrus

[cinepro]

The article basically says that the Church borrowed the idea from the Cochranites.

From the Fair Wiki:

FAIR does not advocate removing any references from Wikipedia articles. The best approach to editing Wikipedia is to locate solid references to back up your position and add them rather than attempting to remove information.

Go for it.

[Jason]

Go for it.

I have a better idea - I'll just ignore the Wikipedia entry, as I do most Wikipedia entries that don't cover comic books or pop culture (which are the somewhat accurate ones).

[california boy]

The article basically says that the Church borrowed the idea from the Cochranites.

I don't know much about the Cochranites, but it seemed that the part they wrote about was pretty well documented. I don't think Wikipedia would be considered official church history, but from what I can tell from a lot of comments on this site, official church history is a bit illusive. Wikipedia isn't written to be faith promoting nor is it to testify of the truthfulness of the restored gospel. I guess over the years I have seen so many blatantly inaccurate portrayals of the church, this one seems pretty accurate and it seem petty to pick at the points that from a historical point of view happened. The conclusion that the Mormons borrowed the idea of polygamy is just a guilt by association thing. They don't state it as fact.

[Palerider]

In recent years I have come to see Old Testament plural wives as being more of something God permitted or "winked at" rather than promoted. I may be wrong but I can't remember any Biblical references stating that Heavenly Father "gave" the wives to their husbands. Sarah gave Hagar to Abraham in an act more of desparation and David and Solomon seem to "take" their wives.

Under the higher Law of Christ it seems that the indication is more towards leadership (who sets the example) "Bishops should have only one wife" etc. It implies obviously that multiple wives might occur and be accepted but are not the preference.

[LeSellers]

I may be wrong but I can't remember any Biblical references stating that Heavenly Father "gave" the wives to their husbands.

Try this one:

7 And Nathan said to David, Thou art the man. Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, I anointed thee king over Israel, and I delivered thee out of the hand of Saul; 8 And I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah; and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things [literally, I would add to thee such and such things].

Were we to list all the husbands in plural marriages from the Bible, you would be hard pressed to find a wicked man among them (aside from Lamech). However, among them were God's friend, Abraham, and children of the promise: e.g., Jacob and Judah. David was but one who received multiple wives from God.

Lehi

[Jason]

I don't know much about the Cochranites, but it seemed that the part they wrote about was pretty well documented.

The basic facts - that there was a man named Jacob Cochran, that the group he formed practiced polygamy, and that there were many converts from his group to the Church including members of the Twelve - may very well be correct. It is the inferred causality - that this is where the Church picked up the practice from - that is shoddy article writing.

The conclusion that the Mormons borrowed the idea of polygamy is just a guilt by association thing. They don't state it as fact.

Yes they do. The section it appears in is titled "the origin of plural marriage", and it is the only explanation that appears in that section. There is not a word from Joseph Smith or Brigham Young for how they believe plural marriage originated.

[thesometimesaint]

Palerider:

Here is how my copy of the KJV of the Bible reads.

A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;