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Bill "Papa" Lee

A faith divided: (From Deseret News

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What should be our attitude concerning our Brothers and Sister (from any Nation)?

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

John 10:1

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I see it as the emphasis on two laws, which law takes precedence and how do we approach the issue based on those laws? One is the law of mercy and the other is enshrined in our Articles of Faith as the law of the land.

This is when a prophet earns his pay. :P Or whatever blessing he has coming with his office.

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I see it as the emphasis on two laws, which law takes precedence and how do we approach the issue based on those laws? One is the law of mercy and the other is enshrined in our Articles of Faith as the law of the land.

Sure. And mercy is applied when.........

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Not a Utah Mormon but I am all for legal immigration, my dad was a legal immigrant when he came to Canada from Germany.

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Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

John 10:1

I haven't staked out a position in the immigration debate. However, the above strikes me as a misapplication of scripture.

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I too am a legal immigrant. And in my view I would apply mercy first, it is what Christ showed me. But there is a big gulf between mercy and the methods of mercy and what would be best in the long run. I think most people are not on the either/or of the situation but somewhere in the middle.

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In the Book of Mormon we read

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Does anyone know what Bishops are to do when they know someone is here illegally? Does anyone know?

Our Stake President knows, he still gives out temple recommends and treats the members equally.

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Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

John 10:1

I haven't staked out a position in the immigration debate. However, the above strikes me as a misapplication of scripture.

On the surface, it's text is simply being used to answer the question. However, in the spirit of likening the scriptures unto us as well as everything temporal also being spiritual etc., I would say it applies perfectly to the situation. You can't enter God's kingdom by another way and be considered legitimate. So likewise, one cannot enter a temporal kingdom by a way not established by that kingdom and be considered legitimate.

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On the surface, it's text is simply being used to answer the question. However, in the spirit of likening the scriptures unto us as well as everything temporal also being spiritual etc., I would say it applies perfectly to the situation. You can't enter God's kingdom by another way and be considered legitimate. So likewise, one cannot enter a temporal kingdom by a way not established by that kingdom and be considered legitimate.

You correctly point out that it refers to God's kingdom. A secular or political application amounts to, as I said, a misapplication.

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On the surface, it's text is simply being used to answer the question. However, in the spirit of likening the scriptures unto us as well as everything temporal also being spiritual etc., I would say it applies perfectly to the situation. You can't enter God's kingdom by another way and be considered legitimate. So likewise, one cannot enter a temporal kingdom by a way not established by that kingdom and be considered legitimate.
You correctly point out that it refers to God's kingdom. A secular application amounts to, as I said, a misapplication.

On what basis? If one can apply it to God's kingdom then it is a misapplication of scripture to not be able to liken it to a temporal kingdom God has set up and named Jesus Christ as the God of it and required that everyone who lives there to keep the commandments or be swept off.

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On what basis? If one can apply it to God's kingdom then it is a misapplication of scripture to not be able to liken it to a temporal kingdom God has set up and named Jesus Christ as the God of it and required that everyone who lives there to keep the commandments or be swept off.

Even if one accepts as a given that Jesus Christ leads the United States of America, it is a stretch to say He sanctions any particular political administration or regime currently in office, and it is improper to convey the impression that He endorses a political position in immigration or other matters of public policy.

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I wonder how all fired up the early Saints were about enforcing Governor Lilburn Boggs' extermination order.

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which means then, the 9/11 terrorists were brought by the hand of the Lord to commit their act.

which also means then, Angel Maturino Res

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Or when they illegally entered Mexico to settle Utah. :P

Saints entered Utah valley in 1847

The treaty of Guadeupe Hidalgo was signed in 1848

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Muslims are being brought here to punish us...

Your interpretation is not accepted by the prophet and apostles nor myself.

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Your interpretation is not accepted by the prophet and apostles nor myself.

Jeff, but for those that use the Book of Mormon to defend illegals, then it must also be true that 9/11 was the hand of the Lord

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I don't think that that scripture is talking about the United States, but rather the Americas in general. I don't think it has anything to do with border control.

Good point...did not think of that. Thanks.

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Our Stake President knows, he still gives out temple recommends and treats the members equally.

This is why I asked about Bishops, and what they are to do. Does the Bishop know as well. Keep in mind a temple Recommend is for any Temple anywhere in the world.

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which means then, the 9/11 terrorists were brought by the hand of the Lord to commit their act.

which also means then, Angel Maturino Res

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On what basis? If one can apply it to God's kingdom then it is a misapplication of scripture to not be able to liken it to a temporal kingdom God has set up and named Jesus Christ as the God of it and required that everyone who lives there to keep the commandments or be swept off.

I used that scripture because someone used it in one of our Fast and Testimony meetings in that context.

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I wonder how all fired up the early Saints were about enforcing Governor Lilburn Boggs' extermination order.

True. :P

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