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Anijen

First Humans Adam And Eve?

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The one about the donkey. (You didn't get my joke...)

Oh, I got it. Was it supposed to be funny? :P

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I believe it is critical that we properly interpret evidence to find out what is true.

And I agree with you on that. I have a different standard of "proof" for spiritual and physical truths. I love the Scriptures! I read them daily. But I don't read Genesis as a science manual and I don't think it is wise or even respectful to consider it as such. I consider God our creator, and the more I learn about science, the more brilliant I believe God to be.

Oh, I got it. Was it supposed to be funny? :P

Well I thought it was.... <_<

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I couldn't help but notice that the person who wrote that article was also a human.

What is the reason you believe what he thinks?

Sorry, I missed this question. I am in agreement with all of his conclusions (in this paper.) I agree with him because I see the same level of support from all the disciplines that he mentions.

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Sorry, I missed this question. I am in agreement with all of his conclusions (in this paper.) I agree with him because I see the same level of support from all the disciplines that he mentions.

Hi Katherine,

I hope I won't get on your nerves by asking you the same question again, but I still can't understand your reasoning.

Do you believe what someone thinks and says simply because other people support what that someone thinks and says? Is that your reason... because other people agree with that person?

If so, why, then, do you believe and accept what those other people think and say?

And btw, just in case you respond with the idea that you believe what you believe because you think what you think and believe "makes sense", and other people also agree with you, try thinking that anything can make sense from a certain perspective. Things can "make sense" and still not be the truth.

So, again, why do you believe what you believe?

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I have a different standard of "proof" for spiritual and physical truths.

I just saw this response. Can you explain why or elaborate a little more?

What do you think is the difference between a "spiritual" truth and a "physical" truth, and if there is a difference, how do you know there's a difference?

I love the Scriptures! I read them daily. But I don't read Genesis as a science manual and I don't think it is wise or even respectful to consider it as such. I consider God our creator, and the more I learn about science, the more brilliant I believe God to be.

Please explain how you learn about and more about science.

Do you ask God to guide your interpretations?

If the words from scientists are not in harmony with words from prophets, how do you determine which words (or thoughts) you should believe?

... do you simply try to determine how many other people agree with them and then believe the words that most people agree with?

As a member of our Church I wouldn't think that's what you do but that seems to be what you are describing.

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I just saw this response. Can you explain why or elaborate a little more?

What do you think is the difference between a "spiritual" truth and a "physical" truth, and if there is a difference, how do you know there's a difference?

Please explain how you learn about and more about science.

Do you ask God to guide your interpretations?

If the words from scientists are not in harmony with words from prophets, how do you determine which words (or thoughts) you should believe?

... do you simply try to determine how many other people agree with them and then believe the words that most people agree with?

As a member of our Church I wouldn't think that's what you do but that seems to be what you are describing.

Why does it have to be either/or? Why do you feel like you have to choose between science and spiritual truths? Wouldn't it make more sense to try to find as much scientific and spiritual truth and try to make them work together? It seems to me that some scientific truths are obvious enough that they require us to adjust our intepretation of spiritual truths. But you don't have to throw out science just because it disagrees with what you think you already know. And the converse is true, as well.

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Why does it have to be either/or?

It's either/or only if/when scientists disagree with God... including what God tells us through prophets.

Why do you feel like you have to choose between science and spiritual truths?

Truths are truths, IMO. I don't divide truths into "physical" truths and "spiritual" truths.

Scientists are free to accept truths if they want to.

Wouldn't it make more sense to try to find as much scientific and spiritual truth and try to make them work together?

Truths DO work together.

That's one of the neat things about truths. They're all true.

It seems to me that some scientific truths are obvious enough that they require us to adjust our intepretation of spiritual truths.

All truth works in harmony, together.

But you don't have to throw out science just because it disagrees with what you think you already know.

I don't.

The question was:

How do you know the truth when you find it?

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It's either/or only if/when scientists disagree with God... including what God tells us through prophets.

Truths are truths, IMO. I don't divide truths into "physical" truths and "spiritual" truths.

Scientists are free to accept truths if they want to.

Truths DO work together.

That's one of the neat things about truths. They're all true.

All truth works in harmony, together.

I don't.

The question was:

How do you know the truth when you find it?

I asked you the same question. What do you do when you find that something you accept as true appears to conflict with the teachings of the church?

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I asked you the same question. What do you do when you find that something you accept as true appears to conflict with the teachings of the church?

I accept the truth as soon as I know what is true.

And now back to my question:

How do you know what is true when you find it?

And btw, I already know what I do. I just want to see if you do the same thing. :P

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I accept the truth as soon as I know what is true.

And now back to my question:

How do you know what is true when you find it?

And btw, I already know what I do. I just want to see if you do the same thing. :P

I weigh the evidence, physical, logical, and spiritual. And I go with what seems most likely and what makes most sense.

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I weigh the evidence, physical, logical, and spiritual. And I go with what seems most likely and what makes most sense.

Is that all?

I take it one step further and ask God.

... and sometimes God helps me think of things that I hadn't even thought of. :P

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Is that all?

I take it one step further and ask God.

... and sometimes God helps me think of things that I hadn't even thought of. :P

Have you asked God if gravity is true? I take it to God when I feel I need to. Otherwise, I don't feel like I need to bother him with every last detail.

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Have you asked God if gravity is true?

What do you mean by gravity?

Are you referring to a curve in space that sets things in motion?

God has told me a little bit about what we know as gravity but I still don't know everything about it.

I take it to God when I feel I need to.

How do you know when you need to and when you don't?

How do you know you know enough about what you think you know now?

I like talking to God about everything.

Otherwise, I don't feel like I need to bother him with every last detail.

It's no bother, I've found. I always ask of God and never have felt upbraided.

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What do you mean by gravity?

Are you referring to a curve in space that sets things in motion?

God has told me a little bit about what we know as gravity but I still don't know everything about it.

So, you go to God in prayer to learn about gravity? Interesting.

How do you know when you need to and when you don't?

I suppose that would be different for each person.

How do you know you know enough about what you think you know now?

I never know enough. Of that I'm pretty confident.

I like talking to God about everything.

It's no bother, I've found. I always ask of God and never have felt upbraided.

I don't talk to God about everything. It seems to me he gave me a brain and wants me to learn to use it. If I ask him about everything, I'm not using my own brain.

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So, you go to God in prayer to learn about gravity? Interesting.

Yes, as well as about everything else. :P

I don't talk to God about everything. It seems to me he gave me a brain and wants me to learn to use it. If I ask him about everything, I'm not using my own brain.

You don't think it's possible to use your own brain while you talk with God?

Interesting.

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Yes, as well as about everything else. :P

You don't think it's possible to use your own brain while you talk with God?

Of course, but I believe God expects me to learn a lot on my own. IIRC the brother of Jared was supposed to come up with solutions on his own. In the same way, I don't expect that I have to ask God for help in things that I can determine on my own.

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Of course, but I believe God expects me to learn a lot on my own.

I agree, but I believe He also expects us to consult with Him during our thought processes to make sure He approves of our thoughts, and ideas, and choices. It can be an "and" and not just an "either/or" thing.

IIRC the brother of Jared was supposed to come up with solutions on his own.

In my perspective, the Lord was having a discussion with the brother of Jared in which He asked the brother of Jared what he thought he should do, and the best thing the brother of Jared could have done was to let the Lord know what he was thinking while asking the Lord if He thought his idea was a good one.

You don't seem to realize that they were having a discussion.

In the same way, I don't expect that I have to ask God for help in things that I can determine on my own.

Perhaps you have a limited view of what a prayer is, as I once did before I learned better.

I'm not trying to suggest the idea that I drop to my knees every time I need to make a decision.

A prayer doesn't need to be a formal prayer like that.

I often pray to God without anyone but God knowing that I am praying, and I seek God's counsel so I don't do something stupid.

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I agree, but I believe He also expects us to consult with Him during our thought processes to make sure He approves of our thoughts, and ideas, and choices. It can be an "and" and not just an "either/or" thing.

In my perspective, the Lord was having a discussion with the brother of Jared in which He asked the brother of Jared what he thought he should do, and the best thing the brother of Jared could have done was to let the Lord know what he was thinking while asking the Lord if He thought his idea was a good one.

You don't seem to realize that they were having a discussion.

Perhaps you have a limited view of what a prayer is, as I once did before I learned better.

I'm not trying to suggest the idea that I drop to my knees every time I need to make a decision.

A prayer doesn't need to be a formal prayer like that.

I often pray to God without anyone but God knowing that I am praying, and I seek God's counsel so I don't do something stupid.

I think I know what you mean. You sounded to me like one of those guys who asks God what cereal to eat. I'm sorry for misunderstanding you.

Despite my experience with Mormonism, I still do believe in God and in prayer. What's been interesting to me is that my wife and I have received the same answers when we have prayed, even though she is an active, believing member of the church and I am not.

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I think I know what you mean. You sounded to me like one of those guys who asks God what cereal to eat. I'm sorry for misunderstanding you.

I'm still not sure that you did. Some cereals are better than others. :P

Despite my experience with Mormonism, I still do believe in God and in prayer. What's been interesting to me is that my wife and I have received the same answers when we have prayed, even though she is an active, believing member of the church and I am not.

Sounds interesting. I'd like to know more about what you are referring to. <_<

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So, again, why do you believe what you believe?

I believe what I believe because of the way my brain processes information. Your posts seem to hint at some form of superior knowledge and wisdom. Do you want to elaborate on it?

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I believe what I believe because of the way my brain processes information.

That's a succinct way of putting it. That's what I've been trying to say unsuccessfully.

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That's a succinct way of putting it. That's what I've been trying to say unsuccessfully.

I'm not sure my putting it that way will be successful either! :P

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I believe what I believe because of the way my brain processes information. Your posts seem to hint at some form of superior knowledge and wisdom. Do you want to elaborate on it?

Okay, a little bit.

God's knowledge and wisdom is superior to man's knowledge and wisdom without God.

I never saw you clearly state that you received personal revelations from God.

... you keep talking about your brain and your way of seeing things.

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Okay, a little bit.

God's knowledge and wisdom is superior to man's knowledge and wisdom without God.

I never saw you clearly state that you received personal revelations from God.

... you keep talking about your brain and your way of seeing things.

And what does that have to do with evolution?

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And what does that have to do with evolution?

Do you need a recap of our discussion?

I was asking why you don't believe we are descendants of Adam and Eve.

I think you were basically saying you don't because scientists are against that idea based on the way they interpret evidence.

I then asked why you accept the way scientists interpret evidence even though their interpretation of the evidence is contrary to what we are told by prophets of God.

You then said something about my posts suggesting the idea of superior knowledge and wisdom and asked if I wanted to elaborate.

I was basically saying God has it, and scientists who disagree with God don't.

I still don't understand why you interpret evidence the way you do.

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