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Everything posted by oklds

  1. In August 2013, my son Alan had been invited to church by Abby, a girl from his school, and he asked me if we could go on Wednesday night. Not being much for any specific religious sect (I despised them all equally), I reluctantly agreed and asked him what Church. I knew I had a couple of Mormons way back up the Family tree, but I didn't know much about them otherwise. But I didn't really object, and I went mainly to get a look at the type of girls my son liked (When I saw this one, the phrase "swinging for the fence" came to my mind). That was on 8/21/13; I got a copy of the Book of Mormon and took it home to read. By Saturday night, I'd read enough to be absolutely fascinated, but found a lot of terminology hard to understand. So on Sonday I took my whole Family to see if we could find someone to give us more information. Out in the hall, I collared two young men with badges declaring them to be "Elder George" and "Elder Zerkle". They didn't look very elderly to me, but I decided to play along; I asked them if they would mind stopping by our house sometime and explaining some passages in the Book of Mormon to me and my family. There were 25-30 people standing in the hallway chatting, waiting for Sacrament service to start, and they all went instantly silent from shock. It was like those old EF Hutton commercials, "When EF Hutton talks..." I thought maybe I had overstepped some sort of doctrinal boundary, so I offered to pay them for their time and gas if they would only come over and answer my questions. A brother Kronk saw the look on my face, clapped me on the back, laughed and informed me that the process usually worked the other way around. "The missionaries usually go out to people's homes and tried to get them to come to Church. We're not really used to people coming into the Church and trying to get the Missionaries to visit their homes." Before service, another fellow introduced himself as "the bishop" (emphasis on the lower case - a VERY low-key individual) and asked me what I did for a living. I had been to a lot of churches, and introductions to the big shot were inevitably followed by admonitions to come back, get saved, put more money in the plate, etc. Not this guy; he really wanted to know about me and my Family. When I told him I was an engineer, I found out that he was also and had used a tool which I had designed. We stood there blocking traffic and talked engineering while the rest of the congregation flowed around us. My Wife joked later, "You need to stay away from that guy. When you get together with another one of you, it's like throwing gasoline on a flame. Trying to get either of you back into the real world is nearly impossible." That was the OKC 5th ward's introduction to the Judd family. Over the next 94 days, I put those Missionaries as well as Thompson through a litany of trials and tribulations, ending (or maybe beginning) with myself, my Wife, my Son and my Daughter being Baptized, one-right-after-another, on 11/23/13.
  2. We've got a bunch of good stories. Best thing about ours is they all have multiple witnesses. :) You wanna hear about: 1. McD's breakfast for Fast Sonday before Church.... 2. How to make Missionaries behave in Church... 3. Missionaries determining sheep gender... 4. Loading ramps appearing in road when requested (kinda creepy, this one)... 5. Where to go to buy some "Book of Mormons" to give to Mormon kids.... 6. You folks call it a miracle....we just call it 'Tuesday'.... Got those and couple hundred more. Just lemme know.
  3. There is no paint on this at all. It as all made by mosaic of tiny rocks of different colors. And, yes, you have seen it before.....
  4. oklds

    Anybody remember seeing this?

    There's a picture of the owner wearing this, in the Church history museum in SLC.
  5. I'm not even sure this is a real thing, but if someone has heard of it, would you be so good as to explain it to me, please? Thanks very much, Dan
  6. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    I agree. You have shown me the light. I will immediately take the metal articles (you notice I did not refer to them as artifacts because you said they weren't) to the local metal recycling yard, and burn the papers, since they are taking up valuable SD box space. Thank You so Much!
  7. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    I do not account for it at all. I have coins which contain mineral endemic to North America. Period. The minerals contained in the metal of those coins were not 'lost' in the coins. Nor do I care what "many other academic sites" will confirm or not. It is what it is. Furthermore, I do not know that they were pressed (do you understand the difference?) by any peoples from the Book of Mormon. However, I am convinced that there was not another civilization that came here, mined metal, pressed coins, and then left them here and went home. From what I understand, the Hopewell is a fraud. And no, I am not going to make copies for your benefit. So, it seems the only thing we shall agree upon is that Rod Meldrum is a jackass. If this back-and-forth diatribe accomplishes nothing more than that, it will have been worth it anyway, in my opinion. :) Regards
  8. Any questions you can send me at [email protected]; there are a lot of questions I do not answer in public, since I am tired of being 'ragged on' because I do not know the terminology some folks use.

    There is no pretense about me whatsoever.  My name is Dan Judd, my email is [email protected], and my number is 405-882-4263.  My Family are new Converts, although some of my ancestors were involved with the Church in the earliest (literally) days.

    Dan Judd

  9. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    You have never seen them, so what gives you the idea that the handwriting was/is not his? They have never been "promoted as being his maps" EVER. I am not even sure illustration #1 is a map, but I think it is. The other I am sure of, because I have been there. The fact that coinage was found at that location dating to the 4th century BC, and containing elements endemic to North America is irrefutable evidence that people were mining metals in North America and pressing coins with it within 120 years of Lehi's arrival here. As to the armor and weaponry, I have no idea nor opinion, since I have not had the opportunity to get inside to check it out. I will, however, sooner or later, then I will know. Something my Wife mentioned today was that if DNA could be extracted from dried fluids resulting from wounds sustained while wearing it, that would go a long way towards making a connection to a specific ethnicity. As to the round-ring-ball thingy, I have no idea. The metal was not corroded at all, and was certainly not copper or bronze. The spinning piece in the center and the one in one of the rings was of a different metal entirely, but I no not know what that was either. I also do not know where it went, but I will try to draw it from memory. If I can get my scanner to work, I will post that. I and my siblings used to play with it as kids, but I have no idea where it ended up after my parents' divorce. Probably in the trash, unfortunately. It was not in Dad's stuff after he died. Be that as it may, NO ONE has ever seen those illustrations except me and one of my friends, who is actually not a member of the Church, and one ex-banker who neither knew nor cared what they were. As to Rod Meldrum and his theories, I consider myself biased because I dislike him personally. However, that does not make him wrong. In fact, these coins are evidence with great weight that he is almost certainly right. Think about this: The metals they were made with came from the western part of what is now the Carolinas. That metal was used to press coins less than 200 years after Lehi's arrival. That those coins were in a cache referenced by a map contained in what are euphemistically known as the "lost 116 pages" is evidence that they were from the Nephite culture. I could be wrong, but I'm not. BTW, the first 88 SHEETS (176 PAGES) were, in fact, written by Emma Smith, and have absolutely nothing to do with Lehi's 'travelogues'. They are strictly religious in nature. The other 26 SHEETS were written by a totally different hand; much larger and cruder. I suspect those are what gave people the idea that the 116 were the first part of some other Book within the Book of Mormon. I am inclined to agree with that. The Book of Mormon itself bears this out; doesn't it say somewhere that the first items transcribed by Joseph Smith were from a different set of plates than the rest? But the writing/labels on the maps matches that on those SHEETS, and there is nothing in those words which corresponds to any modern reference ("78 miles northeast of Denver" or any such nonsense". The maps could not have been drawn by Mrs. Smith. I started my career as a draftsman, (back in the day when we used pencils, not CAD systems) and I was known as an 'engraver', since I drew with enough pressure to indent the vellum (very common for old-time draftsmen), so that the lines and writing could be felt clearly from the back side. These are both like that; the script is light, the lines have indented the paper itself. Even Harry noticed that when he looked at the SHEETS. And, yes, I keep capitalizing the words SHEETS and PAGES, since most folks can't seem to grasp (no pun intended) the difference.
  10. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    Never put off til tomorrow what someone else will probably get around to doing next week anyhow.
  11. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    On the text specifically, no. I've told everything I know, but here's the short version again: There are 116 SHEETS (as opposed to PAGES). The first 88 SHEETS have very small and precise cursive script on both sides (88 SHEETS = 176 PAGES). Another 26 SHEETS have large and mostly crude cursive script on one side, and 26 SHEETS have notes and scribbling on the backs (26 PAGES). The last two SHEETS have illustrations on one side. One is definitely a map; I have been there. The other one probably is as well, but I cannot correlate that to any georef (doesn't match anything I can find). My Great-Grand-Father Thomas went to the location on the map, and retrieved: 1. One round wire-frame thing; I have no idea what it is/was or what it's use was. 2. The top of a statue's head, broken off about mid-face, made of serpentine rock. 3. One coin, about the size of a penny, which is almost illegible. He also got his hands on a long knife/sword, but dropped that and could not reach it to retrieve it. He told us that there were 10-12 clay jars, about 20 gallons each. One of these had been broken, with coins spilling out. There was also enough armor and weaponry to equip 200-300 men. Several other items which I don't choose to go into. My Dad's friend and Mother's Cousin's Husband, Dr. Harper (a PhD at JPL), had a metallurgical analysis done of that in 1970 or 71, and found thta it was mostly copper, with a little (4.6%) iron, and four other elements which I had never heard of: Nautneague, Neodymium, Monozite, and Bastnaesite. Russ declared the report to be erroneous, since at least two these are ONLY found in North America, and therefore could not have (in his opinion) come from here. Monozite-bearing copper is ONLY found in the eastern half of what is now the Carolinas, so that is where the metal was mined. The JPL metallurgist dated it at 1,800 to 2,500 years old. The wire-frame doohickey I played with as a child, and could probably draft a fairly accurate drawing of it. I do now know where it is, but probably lost during my parent's divorce. The statue head one of my siblings kept, but don't know what became of it. I suspect it is long gone. The coin I got in a box of Dad's stuff after he died. That should bring everybody up-to-date. As of now: I had another metallurgical analysis done which results match that one exactly, with one exception. They claim it is 2,300 years old, +/- 50 years. Someone else told me that with the confirmation report, that made it extremely valuable, so I put it in a SD box. I could have a full-scale analysis done, but it would be a destructive test, and very expensive. I don't mind having the coin destroyed, since if it is accurate, I can get a lot more. If it is not, then it was worthless anyway. But, I cannot afford to do so; I've got too much into this already anyway, and not going to ask anyone else to spend their money on it. When the weather gets warmer, I intend to go there and basically loot the place. Then I'll know for sure. Anybody got any better ideas, I'd love to hear 'em.
  12. I'm curious; maybe I'm not looking in the right place, but what exactly did this guy do?
  13. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    Not on the text, no. I refuse to release that in any format. Two reasons: First, what if it's wrong? I'm NOT gonna be the one who spreads false doctrine based on documents which have not been proven to be Scripture. Second, if it's real, I'm not gonna have any of that foil-hat crowd transcribing those sheets and publishing their own "Book of Lehi". After it was reported that a General Authority named Bruce Porter had inspected the 116 and declared them authentic in 12/2016, 8 or 10 people came to my home trying to get (pleading, threatening, cajoling) me to give them copies of the sheets. I never actually spoke with Elder Porter, and never saw any report from him, so cannot verify that part of it. At that time, I did not even know what a General Authority was. As far as proving authenticity, I believe I may pretty close. One of three artifacts recovered from map #2 (which contains sufficient data to locate current location, which has been done) is a small coin, about 2,100 (+/- 80) years old. The coin, as such, is insignificant, but a metallurgical analysis was done by one of my Dad's friends at JPL. Mostly copper, a little iron; pretty standard stuff. What makes that coin significant is that it contains traces of elements endemic to North America. There are others in the same jar which are much older. I believe that particular artifact which Thomas recovered from that site proves the authenticity of those sheets. I also think there are details contained in map #1 (which I cannot correlate to any current georef), which will shed light on all this 'meso-America stuff. Get it? That coin, along with a jar of others, was minted (images on both sides) in North America in the first century B.C. I could be wrong, but I ain't.
  14. oklds

    The "Heartland Theory" (?)

    Short answer: No. Long Answer: I have a couple of maps, both drawn by Joseph Smith himself. I also have several artifacts which came from those map locations. I also have 114 other sheets of written text, mostly written by his Wife from his dictation. You may have heard of them. None of that changes my opinion of the Book of Mormon either.
  15. oklds


    I find myself in need of a videographer for a project in the eastern Colorado/western Nebraska area, for approximately 2 weeks, perhaps as long as 2 months. Anybody know someone who can meet these qualifications:1. Temple-worthy Melchizedek Priesthood holder (active Temple Recommend)2. Capable of walking for up to 15 miles, if necessary3. Notarized NDA.4. Tent residence for up to 4 days (and nights)5. Not claustrophobic6. Clean background and drug-freePluses:1. Former military, preferably Marine Corps or Army. Combat experience is exceptional2. Spelunking or mining experience3. Heavy equipment operation (backhoe and/or dozer)Please contact me at [email protected]