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Bobbieaware

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About Bobbieaware

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    Bobbieaware
  • Birthday 06/02/1953

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  1. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Again, absolutely splendid.
  2. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Toscano’s angst filled open letter to President Nelson is off point and impertinent because he apparently missed an all-important key line that appears at the beginning of the article. Here’s the line Tuscano seems to have missed: “On the other hand, many verses affirm that the higher levels of love the Father and the Son feel for each of us—and certain divine blessings stemming from that love—are conditional.” Note that President Russell says the Father and the Son DO NOW, in the present tense, “feel higher levels of love for each of us.” If he meant to say the Father and the Son do not feel higher levels of love for his children UNTIL they fulfill certain requirements he would have said so. He then a second time refers to that higher love as something that already exists. Everything subsequent to this critically important line makes it clear that our access to those preexisting higher levels of divine love that the Father and the Son DO NOW feel for each of us can only be felt and experienced by us if WE choose to love God and serve him. That is the condition.
  3. Divine Love Is Conditional

    So do you believe God should ignore the law of justice and bless everyone equally?
  4. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Great post! (Can’t give you a rep point because I’m on ‘limited.’
  5. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Maybe because God commands it? Not because the feelings of his love for us diminish, even in the least, if we don’t seek to repent and grow spiritually, but because the immutable law of eternal justice prevents him from pouring out the greater blessings of his love upon those who are not motivated to love him and obey his will. And in fact the very withholding of the more abundant blessings of his love from the disobedient IS MOTIVATED BY HIS PERFECT LOVE because he knows he must allow us to taste the spiritual bitterness we create in our own lives so that we might learn through our own experience how to prize the good. This is all very simple and abundantly corroborated throughout the scriptures.
  6. Divine Love Is Conditional

    God’s feelings of love for each of his children are unconditional, but whether or not he is able to pour out the love he feels in the form of blessings is conditional. That being said, in each and every instance he pours out his feelings love in the form of blessings upon each of his children to the maximum allowable degree without permitting mercy to rob justice. This is the whole burden of the scriptures.
  7. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Of course that’s what he intended to say. Read his address in it’s entirety and see for yourself. The most meaningful and jouful manifestation of God’s is when he pours out his rich blessing upon the children of men. Those who choose to not love and serve God are still looked upon with the eyes of his perfect love, but the blessings of his love are poured out on a conditional basis.
  8. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Read all of my posts on this thread in sequence and then we’ll see if you have the same questions?
  9. Divine Love Is Conditional

    Excellent Response! Another way to explain the principle is that God perfectly loves everyone, but his most earnest desire is to have loving RELATIONSHIPS with his children — relationships where love and mutual respect are regularly expressed in both word and deed — is frustrated when people refuse to love and serve him. God respects freedom of choice too much to force unwanted manifestations of his love on anyone. In addition, love is an an action verb, not just a noun.
  10. Divine Love Is Conditional

    If everything remains precisely the same with regard to God’s ability to demonstrate his love for mankind, whether men chose to love and served him or not, why does the Savior bother to to say anything at all on the subject? Why didn’t he just simply say, “God loves everybody equally, whether they choose to love and serve him or not, so don’t bother to worry if you don’t love and serve him because he loves you just as much as he loves those who do love and serve Him. Don’t worry, be happy.”
  11. Divine Love Is Conditional

    I wonder if you’re at all aware of the fact that there a several verses of New Testament scripture that unambiguously speak of God’s love being conditional? I already posted one of these quotations (delivered by the Savior, no less) and now I will post three more verses for you to consider. 21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me SHALL be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. 22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 23 Jesus answered and said unto him, IF a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father WILL love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. (John 14)
  12. Divine Love Is Conditional

    You’re not differentiating between God’s constant feelings of emotional love that never change and the fulfillment of his love in action. Even Christ testified that the Father’s love toward him was conditioned upon his willingness to successfully endure the agonies of his atoning sacrifice. 17 THEREFORE doth my Father love me, BECAUSE I lay down my life, that I might take it again. (the word ‘therefore’ means “for this reason.”) President Russell got it right...
  13. Divine Love Is Conditional

    The word love can be used both as a noun and an action verb. God’s emotional feelings of love remain constant for all, but his ability to express his love to his children through action can be short circuited and rendered ineffectual if one does not respond in a manner that enables him to receive God’s love. In the eternal scheme of things, mercy (one of the greatest expressions of God’s love in action) cannot rob justice. If God could save us by feelings of affection alone, we would need no suffering and atoning Savior.
  14. Just to let you know, your points would hold much more weigh with me if you would take some time to find and post specific verses of scripture that corroborate your ideas. 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appointed messengers, clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkness, even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. (D&C 138) In connection with the above verse of scripture, I must say I’m somewhat taken aback by what appears to be an almost mocking tone exhibited by you when you responded to my point that Alma was an authorized minister of the true Church of Jesus Christ and that by virtue of his ordination he had the power and authority to preach the true gospel to the Zoramites, teach them in detail how to plant and nurture the seed of testimony (personal revelation) in their hearts, and administer the saving ordinances of the true gospel in their behalf.. As you well know, the fundamental LDS principle of authorized ministers necessarily being the only individuals authorized by God to preach the true gospel and administer it’s saving ordinances to others is Mormonism 101. There is no knowledgeable Latter-day Saint who is unaware of the fact that everyone who has ever lived will have to be taught, baptized and confirmed, either in the flesh or by means of a proxy, by someone who holds the true priesthood authority before they can become members of the Lord’s true Church. So why you appear to exhibit a degree of sarcasm on this critically important gospel principle seems odd. Perhaps I’m reading you incorrectly? The following verse from Alma 32 is the one I was thinking of when I used the expression “full-blown testimony” (a mature testimony). 41 But if ye will nourish the word, yea, nourish the tree as it beginneth to grow, by your faith with great diligence, and with patience, looking forward to the fruit thereof, it shall take root; and behold it shall be a tree springing up unto everlasting life.(3 Nephi 26) Perhaps I should have used the expression “fully-mature” testimony? As a longtime Latter-day Saint, I’m well aware of the fact that the members of the Church have long been encouragement to embrace truth wherever it can be found. I’m also keenly aware that the LDS Church doesn’t have an absolute monopoly on truth and that other Churches have enough truth to make positive spiritual impacts on their members. But because It appears I’m less of a universalist than you are you’ll have to forgive me if I personally conclude a religion that denies the existence of God and asserts men can save themselves without the need for an atoning Savior appears comport more with the “wide gate” and “broad way” philosophies gravely warned of by the Savior, and has far less to do with the good seed of personal revelation described by the Christian prophet and Melchizedek Priesthood authority named Alma.. 33 And it came to pass that when Jesus had ended these sayings he said unto his disciples: Enter ye in at the strait gate; for strait is the gate, and narrow is the way that leads to life, and few there be that find it; but wide is the gate, and broad the way which leads to death, and many there be that travel therein, until the night cometh, wherein no man can work. (3 Nephi 26) I ask the following question sincerely: Do you believe the Zoramite religion of the Rameumpton Tower had the inherent spiritual light and power needed to inspire one of its adherents to plant the good seed of the word of in his heart?
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