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About sunstoned

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    Separates Water & Dry Land

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    Cycling, climbing, and other outdoor activities.

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  1. I am also glad this teaching of BY has been disavowed.
  2. A Prophet of God

    They give talks. That's what our prophets, seers and revelators do now. They give talks just like Billy Graham does. I have not heard any of them claim revelation. Joseph Smith was not sly with this. You knew when he was claiming revelation and when he was just speaking as Joseph. He owned it. Not so much with the Corporation of the First Presidency now.
  3. First Amendment protects God-given moral agency

    You bring up a very good point Button. BTY, welcome to the discussion board.
  4. First Amendment protects God-given moral agency

    I had not really thought about this, but you are correct. The ban is a prime example of a real threat to religious freedom.
  5. First Amendment protects God-given moral agency

    From my view, religious freedom, and freedom in general, is not under any type of attack. No one telling the church, or any religious organization what they can and can't believe, nor what they can and can't practice. Case in point is the Nov. 2015 policy that our church came out with. Many people feel it is very discriminatory, but no one one, not the government, or anyone else has claimed the LDS church does not have the right to make such a policy. In this current climate, we have people like Dalian Oaks yammering on about religious freedom and confusing it with public opinion. The church has not lost any freedoms, but it has lost big time in the arena of public opinion. In a few short years since the passing of GBH, the church as squandered any social capital that it did have by moving into the political area and doubling down on legislation that would limit the freedoms of a group of citizens of this country. The social and political backlash from these actions has been swift and brutal. We are all free to choose our actions, but we can't always choose the consequences. And some times, that can be one hard lesson. Just ask the folks at the COB.
  6. My cousin is a Bishop in Montana. I spoke with in depth on the subject of the current policy at a family reunion we held this summer. He is not supportive of denying children membership because of their parents marriage status, nor will hold court on anyone who is legality married. He claims his counselors are in agreement on this. He told me that there is a gay couple currently attending his ward, and they have been embraced by the ward members.
  7. I can see you point in theory. But the reality is that most of the changes in doctrine/policy have happened because of pressure from outside and within the church. It is not beyond reason that within a few years the majority of members will be pushing for a change in the current policy. We see this happening now. If it grows to a majority status, then I believe the church leadership would seriously review the policy.
  8. Church whitewashing and hiding history

    I am glad to see the church moving in this direction. Openness and transparency are good practices.
  9. I wonder what so important about having the GA speak last. It seems like a silly rule.
  10. I agree this kind of thing can get out of hand. It is okay to show courtesy to people, but this kind of deference to authority along with the church's fixation with outer appearances (facial hair, white shirts, etc) reminds me of some of the practices of the pharisees that Christ spoke against.
  11. The Church is growing so fast...

    No, it is not a tempest in a tea pot. Here is an example of the church's new found Openness. This quote is from Teachings of Presidents of the church: Joseph Smith (chapter 46). The church reports the expositor was publishing "slander", but the reality is that it was the truthful reporting of Joseph Smith's secret polygamist dealings. At best, this is misleading. I personally feel this is organized deception.
  12. I agree that if you are going to count church leadership, then you need to count both quorums of Seventies.
  13. Explaining the Word of Widsom

    This is true. Caffeine has come up in Mormon folklore as a way to justify the ban on the morning beverages of Coffee and Tea. Of course caffeine is a common ingredient of both. But it is also found in over the counter medicines, chocolate, and soft drinks. When you read the revelation on the word of wisdom, caffeine is not mentioned, but then again neither is coffee or tea. If you believe the D&C is inspired, then the word of wisdom is not given as a commandment. That came much later by a Prohibition era prophet who had an agenda. He could not provide a revelation to counter the original D&C revelation. So, we are stuck with elevating certain parts of the Word of Wisdom (coffee, tea, strong drinks, and mild drinks of barley (beer) ) to commandment status, and the rest of it (eat meat sparely, etc.) we just forget about.
  14. I am not sure what you are arguing for here. If it is ethnic diversity in church leadership, then good luck with that. Because the leadership of the church is by far made up of white, privileged men (always men) that largely come from several prominent Mormon families. It has been that way for over 150 years.
  15. Facebook conversation

    Cinepro's probability post explains things very well. You cannot just call out one example as proof that probability is flawed. For every faith promoting story, there are many others support the coincidence. A lot of people pray for the safety of missionaries. What about the missionaries that are killed in auto accidents? Did they take a wrong turn? What about the General Authority that prayed for directions, and then took the wrong road? It is often the case when people would like a certain idea or concept to be true, they end up believing it to be true. They are motivated by wishful thinking. This error leads the individual to stop gathering information when the evidence gathered so far confirms the views one would like to be true. We all need to guard against this.