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Everything posted by omni

  1. I wonder how many believing LDS here are disappointed with the Church’s response? While I understand that many are unhappy with the phrase “get your own planet”, it seems like this would have been an excellent opportunity for the Church to clarify the doctrine. In my experience, the belief that we can become gods and create worlds without number is widely held among the general membership and has been taught by Church leaders from the beginning. Unfortunatley, I think your average reader would come to the opposite conclusion based on the Newsroom response.
  2. We recently attended my in-law’s ward in Orem, Utah and I noticed the bishop was in his mid-thirties with four small children. This isn’t too unusual, however approximately 80% of the ward consisted of retirees with the remaining 20% comprised of newlyweds and a few families. Growing up in the 80s and 90s all of my bishops were in the 45-55 year old range, however since then they have all been in the 35-45 year old range (except for the student wards I attended). It seems that when possible, a retired priesthood holder (or at a minimum one with grown children) would make the ideal bishop. It would allow the bishop to have the time needed to dedicate to the calling, decades of additional church service experience, while not being a burden for those families with young children. I realize my experience is anecdotal, however have any of you noticed bishops getting called at a younger age over the last couple of decades? Is there any scriptural support or have the brethren ever stated why bishops are called at a reletively young age?
  3. omni

    Average age of bishops

    I thought of this as well, but the idea that apostles and prophets need decades of church leadership experience seems to be a modern notion. I realize we live in a different world, however throughout the scriptures and even the modern church we see examples of apostles and prophets who were called without decades of leadership experience. I have a good friend who was called as a bishop a couple of years ago in a well established Utah ward. This friend is very devout and would do anything for the church, however he recently confided in me that when called, he was so upset he initially tried to turn it down, but ultimately accepted after some convincing from the SP. Both him and his wife were experiencing significant health issues, dealing with the recent and unexpected death of a parent, a struggling business they owned, and raising four small children. After recounting a number of horror stories, I expected him to say that after a rough beginning he now loves his calling and couldn’t imagine doing anything else, but instead while things have improved, he still feels like he’s treading water and wonders if he’ll make it. I’m left wondering, is it worth the toll taken on these men and their families when there are often so many other older men that could truly dedicate their time and experience to the calling?
  4. Yes, the Trib covered the story yesterday (I believe they were the first, but don’t hold me to that). I agree, this was done in poor taste and he would likely never pull a similar stunt if the predominant religion were Judiasm or Islam. Disappointing, especially since he was so great on Arrested Development.
  5. omni

    2 hour block

    Come on Scott, linger lingers are great! This is literally the first time I’ve heard someone complain about them. It’s like complaining about puppies or chocolate...or chocolate puppies?
  6. To be fair, it’s pretty easy to not segregate your church into black and white congregations when it would have been imposssible to do so (prior to the ban).
  7. omni

    Largest North American Pyramid Found?

    I’m not familiar with the site, but at the top of the page it states the site is satirical. Also, the disclaimer at the bottom states that everything is made up.
  8. This argument seems to get brought up a lot, but I don’t find it persuasive. Through generations of intermarriage, you would expect to find a high proportion of members (especially those living in the West) to have some polygamy in their heritage, even if it were just two out of their 10 possible ancestors. What If a greater number of people in your classroom scenario raised their hands if they had an ancestoral line that never practiced polygamy (assuming both lines traced back to early Mormonism)? Would that be evidence that monogamous marriages produced more righteous offspring?
  9. Agreed, I think the Tribune does a good job for the most part on taking a balanced approach to reporting stories about the church. The comment section on the other hand is generally a cesspool, view at your own risk...
  10. Why does it have to be a “matter of race-based nose counting” or political correctness? Why can’t it be a matter of statistical improbility? Think about it, in the 175 year history of the church every single apostle and prophet has been a white male. Even taking into account the church’s predominantly white demographics, statistically speaking one would expect at least some non-white apostles over its history. Now if one accepts that race may have played a role when when choosing these leaders (either via God or the Q15), well then that would solve our statistical conundrum.
  11. Wasn't this before Catholic Church and BSA scandals? It's my understanding that a lot of the controls we see in place today (e.g. A bishop must call the hotline after any confession / reporting of abuse) were a result of systemic abuse coverups that we're exposed in the 90s and 2000s. Perhaps Asay was involved in a coverup or more likely it could have been that he simply didn't believe the woman (just like the two singles ward bishops). In other words, the Church appears to have been handling abuse just like most other large institutions were at the time. Of course, if you're claiming to be God's one true church, then I'm not sure the hey-everybody-else-was-doing-it excuse really works.
  12. It's a Christmas miracle, his memory returned! Surprise, surprise, it turns out he was really the victim after all of these years.
  13. I think every family handles these delicate situations differently. My MIL recently passed away after a long battle with dementia. When she did or said things as a result of the dementia, family members would politely explain the situation to help others understand what was occurring. If the "confessions" were simply a result of his dementia, I would think the family would want to get that out as soon as possible to reduce tarnishing his legacy.
  14. You keep bringing up the issue with the interview being conducted under false pretenses, but what relevance does this have with whether or not the allegations are true? We're dealing with a possible federal crime here, should undercover cops be allowed to obtain information under false pretenses? What about whistleblowers? Additionally you keep bringing up dementia. While more information may come out in the future, at this point there is no evidence for dementia other than the fact that Bishop is old and occasionally has issues remembering events that occurred 30 years ago. I find it telling that Bishop's son inferred medication may have played a role in his father's responses, but no mention of dementia. Also, didn't Bishop mention he was getting married in a few weeks? We can't say for certain whether the allegations are true, but it appears from the details the interviewer was able to provide (hot tubbing incident, dinners with his wife, the other sister missionary "molestation", etc.) that something inappropriate likely occurred.
  15. So why does he repeatedly apologize for such a serious accusation? I realize he may not remember the alleged rape attempt, but it appears he feels he was capable of such actions based on other sexual indiscretions he's committed. In fact he admits as much when the interviewer asks him if this sounds like something he was capable of doing and he responds affirmatively (I forget the exact wording and don't have the transcript in front of me).
  16. You're comparing an apology given to relieve the awkwardness or offense in a social interaction (something we have all done) to an apology given after an accusation of rape (probably something none of us have done). Not sure you want to stick with that analogy.
  17. How do you think the interviewer was able to describe some of Bishop's sexual proclivities involving his wife, the hot tub experience, the molestation of the sister missionary, and the room the alleged assault occurred in? While this doesn't prove the assault occurred, I think these details are evidence that at a minimum something inappropriate happened.
  18. 24/7 discernment may be a bit too much of an ask, but how about once during the three years Bishop served as the MTC President? How about once every 18 years? Richard Lyman committed adultry from 1925-1943 while serving as an apostle. If the entire Q15 can go 18 years without discerning one of its own is in an adulterous relationship, then what value is the power of discernment?
  19. Where was the power of discernment in this situation? I assume his calling was approved at the highest levels. How many times as an MTC President did me meet with apostles or members of the First Presidency? Where was the Spirit whispering to these men that something was off? We're not talking about a gospel doctrine teacher who got a little frisky with his girlfriend, Bishop was an MTC President who intereacted frequently with the brethren. Were this a one-off issue, you may have a better case, however similar examples have happened many times in the past and this isn't even the most egregious. Either the power of discernment is a myth or its awfully inconsistent.
  20. omni

    Kind of cool this morning

    You're really digging yourself a hole with this one History is replete with individuals who were able to repeatedly con their victims while making them believe they were successful. Perhaps after a feverish dig with nothing to be found, Josiah actually believed Joseph when he claimed the treasure slipped back into the earth. Does it make sense that God would allow Joseph to use the sacred seer stone to be used for such a disreputable activity (not to mention the fact that it rarely if ever actually worked)? It seems like this story could be a perfect opportunity to teach a lesson on repentance and explain that Joseph wasn't perfect, but isn't it wonderful the Lord uses imperfect vessels to bring to pass his work!
  21. omni

    The Gulf of Mexico (Thread as requested by Robert)

    Interesting, I've never heard this before. Outside of his prayer to know which of all churches to join, do we have any documented instances where Joseph responded to a gospel related question with "I don't know"? It seems today we get a lot more, "We don't know", "the Church has no official position", or "it doesn't pertain to our salvation".
  22. omni

    The enemies of the Church are wrong again

    I'm still perplexed that so many here still haven't figured this out. It should have been obvious after his first couple of posts.
  23. A friendship. However, according to the OP that's not what we're talking about here.
  24. An emotional affair (not sure why so many insist on using scare quotes for the term) can be every bit, if not more damaging than a physical affair. An emotional affair isn't simply being attracted to someone who isn't your partner, it can and often does involve love, sexting, lies, and intimate feelings over a long period of time.
  25. omni

    Scientists find massive society

    I've seen this pop up in my FB news feed a few times, some even going so far as to state "I hate to say I told you so, but....". You hate to say you told us what? While certainly interesting, I fail to see any relevance to the BoM and this find. Haven't archeologists been stating for decades that large sophisticated civilizations existed in this region of the world? The article even states that the estimated population of 10 million is two to three times what was previously thought. I mean, were there any critics going, "ah ha", the BoM claims civializations consisting of 10 million people, but everyone knows there were only 3-5 million people! Additionally, is the discovery of fortifications significant? Given the number of fortified cities throughout the ancient world, wouldn't one expect there to be at least some pre-Columbian cities with fortifications?